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Dec. 14th, 2011 04:46 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
kingtycoonNonsense talk about nonsense- but here in our house we carry it on earnestly!
Once again I mess around with gaming mechanics and work-work-work on ideas about how to make it all better.
Generally I've sickened of the abstractions. I run this game and guys stand toe-to-toe with beasties that are eating their guts out. These cats? They stand there taking it, and wait-wait-wait till they get their chance to smack-em-over-the-head. It's ugly stuff is what it is! The HP grind. Here and there a guy gets thrown over a bridge. Conflict on the bridge being absolutely my favorite trope - one of 'em. I've done a few, but I'm happy to see them written into the modules I run. Good times! And people getting tossed off of them. Nice. Still - the too much abstraction gets to me.
We were taking 7th Sea out for a little spin - having been interested in l5R but maybe looking for a less blackface-ish alternative. So 7th Sea? It's alright- I kind of like the swordfighting rules. Kind of.
There's never any sense that swordfighting is a kind of self-contained and self-referencing idiomatic thing though - there's this idea that whipping out swords makes dudes invulnerably awesome. That's... I blame starwars. Look - tonight we'll roll Rolemaster and that'll be fun - and the guy with a sword is probably going to break it over someone's head - because that's what the hell happens with a sword. There's never a mention that a squire with a great long stick will easily overcome someone with a slashy-slashy sword. Stick and move and play that game all you like, it's a rarified form.
In Klial - I've dealt with this by essentially saying that swords? They're for the ladies- weapons of personal defense - not for the old Warfare - which relies on formations and etc... With a certain amount of breakout - eventually, in Klial, the sword and the swordfighting become an idea that takes off - Judicial Champions - a good way to go - says me - anyway. So that's the legal system - swordfighting - still not a thing in warfare, and still self-contained and self-referential. We discussed it- but in kind of circles. My explanation was - those Olympians - those Koreans who held the standard for shooting pistols at 30 paces? Those guys - they're dead shots, athletes, Olympians - and yet a redneck in a speeding, careening truck defeats them every single time. Every Time! Because, weirdly, weapons are so specific that they loose functionality - mainstay tools - a Car - are easy to adapt to irregular uses, weaponization - fighting.
Fighting being not exactly combat or warfare and certainly not - roll for initiative style melee combat resolution. People go berserk on each other and do whatever they can to issue a beating and stave one off. I've got my ass kicked by enough small groups of men to tell you - you don't need fancy tools to go around killing guys - if you're so inclined. Anyway - it's an ongoing problem for game-building.
Because do you take out the romance of it? cause that's a hell of a sacrifice. Sacrifice the specializations and tricks and cunning, cunning feat trees - and instead have what? Ape-style brawl to the finish?
Maybe. Not much game in that -or too much maybe.
Once again I mess around with gaming mechanics and work-work-work on ideas about how to make it all better.
Generally I've sickened of the abstractions. I run this game and guys stand toe-to-toe with beasties that are eating their guts out. These cats? They stand there taking it, and wait-wait-wait till they get their chance to smack-em-over-the-head. It's ugly stuff is what it is! The HP grind. Here and there a guy gets thrown over a bridge. Conflict on the bridge being absolutely my favorite trope - one of 'em. I've done a few, but I'm happy to see them written into the modules I run. Good times! And people getting tossed off of them. Nice. Still - the too much abstraction gets to me.
We were taking 7th Sea out for a little spin - having been interested in l5R but maybe looking for a less blackface-ish alternative. So 7th Sea? It's alright- I kind of like the swordfighting rules. Kind of.
There's never any sense that swordfighting is a kind of self-contained and self-referencing idiomatic thing though - there's this idea that whipping out swords makes dudes invulnerably awesome. That's... I blame starwars. Look - tonight we'll roll Rolemaster and that'll be fun - and the guy with a sword is probably going to break it over someone's head - because that's what the hell happens with a sword. There's never a mention that a squire with a great long stick will easily overcome someone with a slashy-slashy sword. Stick and move and play that game all you like, it's a rarified form.
In Klial - I've dealt with this by essentially saying that swords? They're for the ladies- weapons of personal defense - not for the old Warfare - which relies on formations and etc... With a certain amount of breakout - eventually, in Klial, the sword and the swordfighting become an idea that takes off - Judicial Champions - a good way to go - says me - anyway. So that's the legal system - swordfighting - still not a thing in warfare, and still self-contained and self-referential. We discussed it- but in kind of circles. My explanation was - those Olympians - those Koreans who held the standard for shooting pistols at 30 paces? Those guys - they're dead shots, athletes, Olympians - and yet a redneck in a speeding, careening truck defeats them every single time. Every Time! Because, weirdly, weapons are so specific that they loose functionality - mainstay tools - a Car - are easy to adapt to irregular uses, weaponization - fighting.
Fighting being not exactly combat or warfare and certainly not - roll for initiative style melee combat resolution. People go berserk on each other and do whatever they can to issue a beating and stave one off. I've got my ass kicked by enough small groups of men to tell you - you don't need fancy tools to go around killing guys - if you're so inclined. Anyway - it's an ongoing problem for game-building.
Because do you take out the romance of it? cause that's a hell of a sacrifice. Sacrifice the specializations and tricks and cunning, cunning feat trees - and instead have what? Ape-style brawl to the finish?
Maybe. Not much game in that -or too much maybe.
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no subject
Date: 2011-12-15 06:44 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-12-15 06:45 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2011-12-15 03:20 pm (UTC)You are a bit hard on swords, but your point is well taken...especially when armor enters the fray. Get thee a hammer, young paladin!